Natey & Katy: At the Movies
Natey & Katy are two friends who love movies and love talking about them. Join them on their cinematic journey!
Natey & Katy: At the Movies
Rosebud Revealed: A "Citizen Kane" Review
Can a film be both a masterpiece and a bit of a snooze? That's the provocative question we tackle as we dissect the iconic 1941 classic "Citizen Kane." Orson Welles’ magnum opus might top AFI's list of the greatest movies, but we confess our mixed emotions, admiring its artistry while questioning its entertainment value for today's viewers. Discover why this cinematic cornerstone only nabbed a single Oscar for Best Writing despite its groundbreaking techniques, and ponder with us how its initial lackluster reception has evolved into lasting influence over modern filmmaking.
With a birthday celebration on the horizon, we set a joyous tone for our next episode, promising more delightful cinematic adventures to come.
Hello everyone and welcome to a brand new episode of Nadine Katie at the Movies. I'm your host, nathan aka Nadie, of course, and with me on today's episode is my good friend Katie. Hi Katie, how are you?
Speaker 2:I'm great, but I think I lost my AirPods, which is a problem. You know how you have you ever opened up your wireless headphones and they're not in the case. And then you're like these are small, I'm not going to find these. They very well could be at the YMCA, but that's fine. So if my audio is bad, I'm sorry.
Speaker 1:It's okay, I forgive you.
Speaker 2:You have to forgive me a lot, don't you?
Speaker 1:Yes, I do. I do have to forgive you a lot. You know, you get so overwhelmed with everything that you're doing and then, when you get overwhelmed with what you're doing, you just feel like you have to have all this power and control, just like our character in today's movie, which is the classic 1941 citizen cane, which is actually the number one movie on the AFI top 100 movies of all time. That's how classic this movie is. So before we can talk about our likes and dislikes, I have to go over the synopsis. Following the death of publishing tycoon, Charles Foster Kane, reporters scrambled to uncover the meaning of his final utterance Rosebud. Citizen Kane stars Orson Welles, Joseph Cotton, Dorothy Commingore and Agnes Moorhead, which I did not know. Agnes Moorhead was in the popular sitcom Bewitched. I did not know that, but she was in that.
Speaker 2:I feel like she was a pretty minor role in this movie.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I didn't even notice she was in it. I just realized she was in it as I was reading the top-billed cast members of this movie. So, katie, what did you think of the 1941 Orson Welles classic? Afi number one of top 100 movies of all time. That means it must be so good. What did you think of Citizen Kane?
Speaker 2:It was OK. Shout out to my neighbor, lee, who has maybe a more classic view of movies, so maybe he lines up more with the things that are oscar nominee and academy award, that I don't, you know, they're artistic but they're not entertaining. If you will, he did give me a warning that I would have to like sit on it for a while and maybe even research more, and I agree with that. The movie itself was not entertaining, borderline, confusing and, uh, there wasn't really a character that stood out to me not even orson welles.
Speaker 1:I mean orson welles is, you know, war of the world radio drama guy.
Speaker 2:He is the epitome of classic well sure I mean, I did like his acting, but he's he kind of looks weird some of it. I didn't even know if it was him the whole time or if, like some people were playing, playing him. I know he's a famous person. Yeah, war of the worlds, dracula, les mis maybe, I don't know. I'm just reading things online, but I just felt like this movie was lost on me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I remember I think I tried watching it before years ago and I just didn't understand the hype of it. I don't know if it's just because it's Orson Welles and it's like when a movie wins an Oscar and everyone thinks it's the best thing ever because it won an Oscar, and then I go to see it and it's a bucket of suck and I don't understand why it got all these accolades and all this stuff. It did win best writing or for an original screenplay. At the 1942 Oscars it was nominated for best picture and best actor and best director, which also was Orson Welles. It was also nominated for best in cinematography black and white, best art direction, interior decoration black and white, best sound recording, best film editing and best music scoring of a dramatic picture.
Speaker 2:It did not win any of those it just won best writing so you want to tell me about one of the best movies of all time and it didn't win most of the categories was nominated for. I'm sorry, but that's that puts into putting. I will say, after researching, as was suggested to me, I understand this is one that you and I talk about. If we watched it in the 40s I think it would be a different story. So maybe the people that are rating it number one are like 70 or 80 years old and this movie hit differently in the world war two era or post world war two era.
Speaker 2:Um, yes, most of the things that were probably so epic about this movie, it's not hitting the same because they already do that in movies. To give it its credit, it's probably a big base for many things the lighting, the use of shadows, the cinematography I'm sure was like wow, we're going to use that in film from now on. You set the tone for being like more realism and in the movie, cool. But going back watching it it's like lost.
Speaker 1:Well, it's funny you say that you know it probably would be better received back in the 40s. According to IMDb, despite all the publicity that this film got when it was released, the film was a box office flop and was quickly consigned to the rko vaults. And at the 1941 academy awards the film was booed every time one of its nine nominations was announced. So this movie was not well received when it was released. It did not do well in the box office, and so it kind of makes me wonder.
Speaker 1:Maybe when it was re-released, apparently in the mid-1950s, that's when it kind of gained more of a following, I don't know if it would be considered like a cult classic. Where a movie comes out, it's a flop, it's kind of like it's a wonderful life was a flop when it was released. All these movies that we consider classics, when they were released they did not do well and the audiences did not like them. So it really does raise the question of what made this movie so you know the golden standard of film when it literally got booed every time its nominations were announced and then it somehow won Best Writing.
Speaker 2:That makes no sense to me. Now, here's the thing. I'm knocking on it a lot, but I don't think it's a bad movie. I think that the character development is great. I think just the whole premise. You're following the rise and fall of a man. You're getting to see how wealth can ruin a person. You can see how relationships affect people. I really loved the part of the story and several people in his life, you know, in the life of what's his name oh citizens Carl Kane.
Speaker 1:Carl Foster Kane. Several people in the life of uh, what's his name?
Speaker 2:oh, citizens carl kate um. Several people in his life called him out for this and what his latest wife did, which was, hey, you only are loving and caring to people because you want them to love you back in return. So like I do think it's got some good messaging in there to really self-reflect on. Like even the most altruistic seeming person is actually potentially just has a big empty spot in their heart and then you see in the movie where that came from, that he's ripped from his mother and father at a young age. So I do think it's a strong story. It's just the execution. It's kind of boring. What did you think about? I mean, the whole way it's set up is you're kind of going back and forth between present and reflection. Did you like that? Like the movie even starts where you think you're watching the movie but you're actually watching a trailer that they've made in the movie yeah, I thought this movie was just one giant snooze fest.
Speaker 1:I I mean again, and that's why I don't understand why people hold it so high up to this standard of filmmaking. It was boring. It was a very long, drawn out movie to build up to what rosebud actually meant and I just don't understand why. And again, it could be because I from what I know of Orson Welles, he had a pretty big ego about himself and so he starred in this film, he helped write it, he directed it, he had his hand in everything with this film and that's kind of just how he was as a person and he kind of fit the character of Charles.
Speaker 2:Foster King. That is so ironic. Is he trying to expose himself?
Speaker 1:I don't know. I just I just didn't find myself caring at all. The entire time I did not care about a single character. And again, this also could be because you and I have said this before. It could be because we've seen movies like this before. We've seen this. You know childhood trauma and it affecting our main character and at the end of the movie you find that he still had had that little bit of innocence within him, even though his whole life he kind of shielded that from other people. We've seen this before and I also knew before I went watch this movie. I knew what Rosebud meant, so I did not care that the entire movie is is revolved around trying to find out what Rosebud means, cause I know what it meant.
Speaker 2:Right. Well, I do think they were kind of using it almost as like a thread, but not necessarily the main point. Like the main point of the movie was not finding out what Rosebud was, it was just the thread that takes you along the storyline. But yeah, it's just now that you say that. You said you weren't really, you didn't care about the character. I really think it goes back to the acting. Like I understand he was famous and really popular and good and a good director but and writer, but he wasn't charming. Like I can just picture several actors that could turn on that charm again. It's like a charm that's sort of darker, but I've seen that executed in other movies that don't come to mind now, but I just don't think he was convincingly charming Like he just seemed like a jerk all around the whole time. So to convince me that people wanted to rally behind him, vote for him in office, marry him. Like the part never made sense.
Speaker 1:So there isn't really anything I liked about it and I know that sounds harsh for this 1941 classic quote unquote movie, but there really was nothing about it that I was like okay, that's why this movie is so well.
Speaker 2:It would be important, no, nathan that we had someone that studied film. I think, weighing in on this, maybe we'll have to get Juddy's opinion, because you studied theater and I think that is very different than film, in that camera shots don't matter in your line of work. And I do think that's probably if I had a good thing about it. It would be that, like, I did think there was some very creative shots. I liked that. It was almost a little eerie, like the whole thing starts out like you're watching a scary movie. Like wait, this is not a scary movie, but I did think there was quite a few cool shots. I liked the zooming in, zooming out. I did think the shadowing gave a lot of emotion. So, again, maybe if a film student was out here they would tell us all the amazing, incredible shots that he did. But you're right.
Speaker 1:That's maybe the most I could give this movie. Well, and I think the you know what's special about our show because you know there's other movie review podcasts out there that go in depth. Like, like you said, camera shots, all this stuff we're just looking at as literally film people like not film people, but like not film people, but like audience goers, like we're literally just giving an audience goer opinion of seeing it sitting down with a bag of popcorn, with a soda.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah.
Speaker 1:And just watching it without not without have. Like you said before, we shouldn't have to have a film background to enjoy a film. Like I should be able to watch a movie and genuinely enjoy it for what it is. And I watched this movie and I did not genuinely enjoy it because I don't understand the hype. It's again.
Speaker 3:It's like the shape of water it's like the movie the shape of water.
Speaker 1:Everyone was giving that movie accolades. I think it won Best Picture. It was like and I saw it myself as a moviegoer, not as a film person, not as a oh my gosh, just the artistry. I went to go see it as just a person who wanted to go see a movie and it was the dumbest thing I've ever seen in my life. And I'm not saying Citizen Kane is the dumbest thing I've ever seen in my life. And I'm not saying Citizen Kane is the dumbest thing I've ever seen in my life Because, like you said, yes, it still holds up as a classic, but not because of its acting or whatever, Because it looks like a classic film. I think that's what this movie has. It looks like a 1940s classic film, but it doesn't mean it's good.
Speaker 2:Right, what I was surprised I thought. Thought I understand the big, like the key takeaway. I think the word rosebud is on like the top hundred movie quotes of all time. Like I kind of thought for a movie that is supposedly the number one movie of all time, I thought that there would be some kind of more pop culture reference, like a scene that I'd maybe seen before or a scene that's been mimicked in other films, or like another line. None of it rang a bell. I mean just so. Anyway, I'm ready to rate this thing and move forward. Some classics hit and some don't for me. So what would you rate Citizen Kane out of six stars?
Speaker 1:See, I don't want to give it a one because, again, it is a classic. So what would you rate Citizen Kane out of six stars? See, I don't want to give it a one because, again, it is a classic. I'm going to give it a one point five because I don't understand the hype, but it does. It has that look and it has that feel of a classic film and so I guess I'll give it a one point five. Because of that, it feels like a classic.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there you go. Well, I'm going gonna give it a two, because I think I see it for what it was. I think it was creative, but it was like you said it was boring and it was.
Speaker 1:It was booed at the, at the oscars it was no one liked it. So that is citizen kane. All you film lovers out there, that's our opinion of Citizen Kane. So, moving on to another classic, which is a movie that I actually already know I like we're going to be talking about the movie that has this clip. Take a listen.
Speaker 4:Tell me what's your lofty mission in life that lets you sneer at my humble profession.
Speaker 3:I'm an actress on the stage.
Speaker 4:Oh, on the stage. Well, I'd like to see you act. What are you in right now? I could brush up on my English or bring along an interpreter, that is, if they let in a movie actor.
Speaker 3:Well, I'm not in a play right now, but I will be. I'm going to New York.
Speaker 4:Oh, you're going to New York, and then someday we'll all hear of you, won't we? Kathy Seldon as Juliet, as Lady Macbeth, as King Lear. You'll have to wear a beard for that one, of course.
Speaker 3:Oh, you can laugh if you want to, but at least the stage is a dignified profession. And what have you got to be so conceited about A shadow? You're not flesh and blood.
Speaker 4:Oh no, Stop. What can I do to you? I'm only a shadow.
Speaker 3:You keep away from me just because you're a big movie star. Wild party, swimming pools. You expect every girl to fall in a dead faint at your feet. Well, don't you touch me.
Speaker 4:Fear not, sweet lady, I will not molest you. I am but a humble jester, and you, you are too far above me. Farewell Ethel Barrymore, I must tear myself from your side.
Speaker 1:Singing in the rain. We're talking about singing in the rain, and I can't wait to talk about it because it's singing in the rain. That's right, we're talking about singing in the rain. If you couldn't guess the fact that I sang singing in the rain more than once, that is a classic musical.
Speaker 2:I can't wait. I feel like um, I've never seen it, but I feel like if you live in modern, if you live on this earth and you're not living under a rock, you you've heard that phrase before or you've even know singing in the rain, like I know that jingle, even though I've never seen the movie.
Speaker 1:So that's what we're going to be talking about three days after my birthday. And our show. And here's, here's our citizen Kane quote old age. It's the only disease, Mr Thompson, they don't look forward to being cured of.
